From co-creatorsMax BorensteinandJim Hecht, and with a pilot directed by executive producerAdam McKay, the 10-episode HBO seriesWinning Time: The Rise of the Lakers Dynastyfollows the intertwining professional and personal lives of the 1980s Los Angeles Lakers. What became one of sports’ most revered and dominant dynasties started with a vision set in motion when Dr. Jerry Buss (John C. Reilly) took over and reinvigorated the franchise, bringing together the flashy characters and the unsung heroes that forever changed the NBA and what the fans grew to expect from basketball.
During this interview with Collider, co-starsTracy Letts(who plays Jack McKinney, the original architect of the Lakers’ Showtime basketball),Jason Segel(who plays Paul Westhead, who came to the Lakers as an assistant coach with McKinney) andDeVaughn Nixon(who plays Norma Nixon, the all-star point guard of the Lakers before the arrival of Magic Johnson) talked about what it was like for Nixon to portray his own father, learning the basketball style of the era, the great freedom Letts had in portraying McKinney, and the personal aspect of himself that Segel wanted to bring to Westhead.
Collider: I am an L.A. native who is fascinated by L.A. history, so I really enjoyed watching this show. DeVaughn, you’re an actor, but you’re also playing your own father in this story. When the possibility of playing Norm Nixon came your way, what was reaction? Were you like, “Okay, they should just give me the role now”? Did you ever wonder if you shouldn’t do it? What went through your head?
DeVAUGHN NIXON: My dad is a harsh critic, but I love it because it made me the person I am today. I like constructive criticism. I love it when people critique me because it makes me wanna work harder, and that’s how my dad is. Me taking on this role, playing him, who is a living person that’s on TV every day. I was like, “Okay, if I don’t play this part right, they’re gonna talk about me.” He’s a commentator, so I’m sure they’d bring it up to him. That was one of my worries. That was a little bit of a fear of mine. I was scared. And then, a part of me was like, “Hey, you know what? People don’t really know your story.” Let’s be honest, if I wasn’t my father’s son, I would’ve only heard of Magic, Kareem, and those people. So, it was a chance to give him his due. I was like, “You know what? I’m gonna take this challenge on.” And I’m glad I did because I happened to think I did a pretty good job.
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What was the most surreal moment for you? Did you have a moment where you just stopped and thought, “Okay, this is strange”?
NIXON: Putting on the jersey for the first time, which was form-fitted to my body. It was a struggle throwing those arms on. And then, once I got it down and I turned around, and I saw the 10 and the Nixon on my back, I sent him a picture. He was like, “Cool.” That was it. That’s all I got. He’s rooting for the series and he’s rooting for everything to do well. I know I’m talking smack right now, but he’s actually very proud of me, and he’s happy.
Tracy, we don’t know much about your character, personally, off the court, because he’s someone who is so focused on the work. How did that influence the way that you thought about Jack McKinney and approached playing him?
TRACY LETTS: It gave me great freedom, in a sense, because I’m not competing with people’s public images of Jack McKinney in their head. From the audience’s point of view, he’s a blank slate. It was all on the page. His vision for how to run a basketball team, how to create this offense, how to use his personnel, all of that stuff was on the page. And certainly, all of that stuff is human stuff that you can identify with. In terms of the actual coaching, I’ve been coached and I’ve had coaches in my life. There’s a tone and a manner that I found pretty easy to access. I also had enough people on the set who were actual basketball players and basketball coaches, and people who would tell me, if I was doing it wrong. I had some guideposts, but also had tremendous freedom to create the character. He was really there on the page.
Jason, your character is interesting because you really get to know him through his relationship with Jack McKinney. Paul Westhead doesn’t really exist to anyone else unless he’s with Jack. How did that relationship define him? How do you think that also helped him find his own voice, once Jack wasn’t there anymore?
JASON SEGEL: I think that what defines Paul Westhead, when we meet him and for probably years before, is an idea that he has decided that he is second best. He says very openly to Pat Riley in discussion that, “At some point, I realized, essentially, that I was trying too hard to be my own man. Maybe what I’m best at is helping someone else be their best self.” What a sad idea for someone to decide that what they are best at is helping somebody else be their best. And then, what emerges around halfway through the season, after McKinney gets injured, is a guy who is forced to shatter that idea and step up because there’s no other choice. So yeah, I think especially in his role with the Lakers, the second he arrives, he is only there because of Jack, and without Jack, he would, in his own mind, not exist to any of these people.
I am only, just at my age, starting to not think of myself as less than an underdog. It’s something that served me very well, at the beginning of my career. All of us from Freaks and Geeks were like, “Oh, I hope people watch this.” And with everything that we ever wrote, it was like, “God, wouldn’t it be great, if somebody watched this.” It’s cute when you’re young. It’s the humility you should have when you’re young. But then, after you’ve done enough stuff, it becomes less cute and it becomes a little like an effect. You realize, “Oh, I need to step into my adulthood and own that I’m good at what I do.” That arc was something I was interested in bringing to this character.
Tracy, it doesn’t really seem like Jack sees Paul that way though. What do you think Jack sees in Paul that makes him want to have him there?
LETTS: The script tells us that what he sees in Paul is his loyalty. It’s his friendship that he values, but also his loyalty. Jack is stepping into a head coaching job for the first time in his life, and he not only wants to bring his friend along, but he wants to bring along somebody who’s gonna have his back, which is what makes the events of the season all the more challenging and even heartbreaking. The truth is that those two guys shepherded this team to a championship. It’s not easy to win an NBA championship, and yet they did. Granted, they had Kareem Abdul-Jabbar and Magic Johnson on the team, so that certainly gave them a leg up, but what they were doing, worked.
DeVaughn, what was it like to shoot the scenes on the court and to figure out how to play a style that wouldn’t necessarily be your own style in basketball?
NIXON: I grew up mostly with the Iversons, so the style of play was crazy different with the crossovers. It was just more streetball. That’s what it evolved into. With the basketball players back then, it was basic dribbles, get to the basket, no showboating. When Magic Johnson came through, that’s when the flash got in. He broke the seal of that. Mostly, it was Kareem shooting sky hooks. Wilt Chamberlain was passing the ball right over the rim, making easy lay-ups. It wasn’t flashy. I grew up with a style of play that was a little bit flashy, like [Michael] Jordan with his tongue out, or Larry Johnson, who’s an underrated basketball player. So, it was about going back to shooting properly and really running the plays, and not just pass it and shoot from half-court, like Steph Curry does. It was a little bit challenging because I wanted to get into my own style of play, but we had a great basketball coach, Idan Ravin, and he would literally be like, “DeVaughn, no, you’re turning over the ball when you’re dribbling like that.” That’s how everybody dribbles now. It was more basic. It was challenging, but I definitely think we hit it on the head.
Winning Timeairs on Sunday nights on HBO and is available to stream at HBO Max.
